On 09/05/14 02:02 AM, Mark Lee wrote:
On 05/09/2014 01:41 AM, Daniel Micay wrote:
On 09/05/14 01:29 AM, Mark Lee wrote:
To Daniel,
I'm pointing out that respect for people shouldn't affect technical skepticism. People can rant against whomever they want as long as it has technical criticism (at least on this mailing list).
Accusing the developers of bad faith and spreading misinformation about the project is not technical skepticism. I'll quote one of my earlier statements:
Bashing an open-source project and spreading FUD about it is always an attack on the open-source community, whether it's GNOME, systemd, KDE, PHP, or something else. It's one thing to take a rational look at a project and criticize it, and quite another to promote content accusing the developers of having bad faith without *any* evidence.
Hence, don't make anything personal.
Regards, Mark
You're implying that I've made it personal, but I don't think I've done any such thing. What have I said that you think is venturing into the land of a personal attack?
To Daniel,
Regarding, your "personal attack". I inferred a personal attack when you claimed that the Arch developers were also SystemD developers and were well respected. It seemed to me like you were peer pressuring the fellow into withdrawing the issue by belittling his credentials in comparison to a community and powerful developers. This looked like a David vs. Goliath situation to me; we shouldn't ever be forcing Archers with questions in this situation. The opinion of a user should be just as valuable as the opinion of a developer.
Calling the systemd developers "chauvanistic" and claiming they have bad faith is a personal attack. There was no issue raised by the person I'm replying to, only flaming and a link to more flamebait containing actual personal attacks and outright lies. They claimed attacking systemd was not attacking the Arch community, and I clearly quoted that part of their message and responded to it by stating that since prominent members of the community (including developers) are systemd developers, attacking the systemd developers *is* attacking the Arch developers. I get the impression that you only skimmed over the conversation or read the last few messages, because you seem to be missing the context.
There are right ways to handle things and wrong ways. The Archer had a technical issue and an opinion. Solving the technical issue is more important. We can usually just ignore the opinion. This may seem hypocritical that I'm typing this (since this doesn't solve the issue for the Archer), so it'll be the last response I make regarding a person's opinionated response (at least on this thread).
With that in mind, I hope the issue's solved for the Archer.
Regards, Mark
The person I responded to is not the one asking a technical question. Here is the first message they sent to the list: https://mailman.archlinux.org/pipermail/arch-general/2014-May/036206.html It's not the original post with the technical issue. It's someone taking the time to link to FUD (ad hominem attacks on the systemd developers, hollow rhetoric and misinformation) because there was a post about systemd. Have you read the content of the link?