On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 3:17 PM, Karol Babioch <karol@babioch.de> wrote:
Hi,
Am 22.07.2012 15:36, schrieb Fons Adriaensen:
to get rid of all that Poetterix
Once again this is not a technical argument, but a very subjective reason with - at least for me - no basis. Its more of a philosophy and that's not what this should be about.
Sure, it is called "Unix philosophy", for what the word "philosophy" is worth. No one says it is the best possible one, but it has shown its worth (I'm sure the same could be said about Mr. Poettering's achievements, but I wouldn't know). Everyone is entitled to have a different one and implement it. No need to start from scratch, they can fork linux. I already suggested a very descriptive name for their new OS. But we end-users of Linux have a reasonable expectation that by using Linux we use a OS that --is Unix-like --is under the user's control and not the other way around
If you *really* like an audio stack without PulseAudio (which I would consider quite useless on a modern desktop) and an init system based upon something as old, "stupid" and slow as SysVinit, then you are free to stick with it. Nobody forces you to use PA and/or systemd, and you are always free to come up with something better than that. But don't try to force your personal agenda against Poettering onto others.
Wrong, they are going to ram systemd down our throats. Believe you me. And why is the onus always on the end-user? *There is* something better, namely the BSD init system and the SysVinit init system. Is SysVinit stupid? By all means, produce something better if you feel you're better that the author(s) of SysVinit. Is SysVinit slow? Maybe lots of bash processes are slowing it down? There are alternatives that don't require a change of init system (for example, http://www.skarnet.org/software/execline/index.html). Should a service be supervised? We don't need systemd (nor launchd, for that matter) to tell us that: http://cr.yp.to/daemontools.html http://smarden.org/runit/ http://b0llix.net/perp/ http://www.skarnet.org/software/s6/ Do you *really* have to use a different init system? runit and s6 do that. What they won't do is to replace other unrelated programs like *chron, and for a good reason: they are made by Unix people.
Maybe this is what it is really about: These changes come - more or less - from Poettering and there is quite a bunch of people who for whatever reasons don't like that idea.
Maybe there is a reason for that? Like, I don't know, maybe a bunch of people find advantageous to run a unix-like system? Best regards, Jorge Almeida