Guys, relax, we are all in the same wagon, it's a nonsense to make anything personal nor to demonstrate who has the bigger dick, fuck off all that shit. As some _DEVS_ had actually stated, let's discuss everything from a TECHNICAL point of view, arguing and ranting because personal dislikes of proposed new technology or procedures should not have a place here, there is a special section in our forums for that and even if you prefer ML you can create a new thread for your rants. Folks, we are suppose to be a community of geeks/nerds/hobbyst whatever else who happens to like IT, who happens to like and in many cases work with GNU/Linux and similar technologies AND -most important- who happens to fucking like Arch Linux because of every single other distro out there Arch is the only one that rocks our boat. So try to be constructive and if someone says something that upsets you please choose your words with care and re-read two or three times your emails before pushing Send because there's no way back afterwards. Let's act like adults (we're all grown ups here), not selfish idiots. Cheers, archers! -- -msx