The latest move of udev to systemd-tools brings up one question for me. When do I need to stop updating my machines so I don't have to switch to systemd? I don't take care of servers or a massive number of systems, just two machines. I have them configured properly and working well using the testing repos and currently don't seem to have any obvious problems. I took a look at systemd and it seems a bit much for my needs; two static wired ip addresses, no laptops, no mobile devices, and one printer. Somewhat old fashion and very simple, one of the reasons I started using Arch Linux to begin with. I don't mean to be derogatory or flippant in any way, and I'm not trying to start a massive thread on the pros and cons of either init system. I appreciate all the work the dev's and tu's have put in to making the system as wonderful and stable as it is. I simply don't believe I need/want systemd. Myra -- Life's fun when your sick and psychotic!