Archers,
For those that haven't used the quicklaunch widget, you need to take a look. The benefit of quicklaunch is that you can put 20-30 apps at your immediate fingertips in the space of 5-6 icons on the plasma panel (one-click access to all your favorite apps) Example:
http://www.3111skyline.com/download/dt/kde4/quicklaunch/quicklaunch.jpg
In order to add it to your plasma (kicker) panel, rt-click the panel and choose 'Panel Options' -> 'Add Widgets', scroll down and choose 'Quicklaunch'.
It will appear at the far right end of your panel instead of where your mouse was due to a design flaw in the panel. To move it where you want it, go throught the same process, rt-click the panel choose 'Panel Options' -> 'Panel Settings' then you can move things around. (be careful not to click outide of the panel or you will have to navigate back to 'Panel Options' once again.
As a matter of preference, I put the quicklaunch right next to the start menu with the pager on its right:
http://www.3111skyline.com/download/dt/kde4/quicklaunch/quicklaunch- location.jpg
of course you can put it anywhere, but when I think "launch application" I'm already programmed to go to the bottom left corner of the screen.
I put systray, device notifier, clock and cashew at the other end of the panel. Just a personal preference:
http://www.3111skyline.com/download/dt/kde4/quicklaunch/right-end-of-panel.j...
You can get rid of any other application icons you have on the panel, because they will now all go in quicklaunch. Also delete the show desktop icon -- you don't need it. If you set your pager settings correctly, then clicking on the current desktop in pager will "show desktop". (rt-click pager, pager options).
To setup quicklaunch, right click it and choose Quicklaunch Settings. Set the visible icons to a sufficient number (I use 24). It won't expand until you put the icons in it. To add your applications to it, just right-click on the quicklauch above the icon where you would like the new icon to reside. (the new addition will push the current icon down (or to the right if it is in the bottom row) when you add it. After you choose add icon, you are presented with a small file open dialog (click on the floppy disk button). Navigate to /usr/share/applications or /usr/share/applications/kde4 to find the desktop file to add. (kde3 apps are in /opt/kde3/share/applications) Just repeat the process until you have the icons you want.
It's not quite as good as putting a subtree from your menu in an icon on the panel (like kde3), but it is a good substitute until Will Stephenson's fix filters down from kde4 upstream. Try this quicklaunch approach, and I think you will find the convenience of the desktop improves quite a bit.
Good luck ;-)
On 10/22/2009 04:56 PM, David C. Rankin wrote:
Archers,
For those that haven't used the quicklaunch widget, you need to take a look.
I like the concept very much, but I think it's a poor implementation. Have a little bar like that a) takes too much space, b) looks very cluttered, and c) it's hard to click on those little icons.
I much prefer adding a folder view onto the taskbar (with the folder consisting of nothing but links to .desktop files) as the icons all hide away nicely when you're not using them:
http://www.darose.net/KDE4FolderView.png
Course, this used to work much better under KDE3:
http://www.darose.net/KDE3QuickBrowser.png
I've got a bug filed to try to make KDE4 work the same way.
DR
On Thursday 22 October 2009 04:06:31 pm David Rosenstrauch wrote:
On 10/22/2009 04:56 PM, David C. Rankin wrote:
Archers,
For those that haven't used the quicklaunch widget, you need to take a look.
I like the concept very much, but I think it's a poor implementation. Have a little bar like that a) takes too much space, b) looks very cluttered, and c) it's hard to click on those little icons.
I much prefer adding a folder view onto the taskbar (with the folder consisting of nothing but links to .desktop files) as the icons all hide away nicely when you're not using them:
http://www.darose.net/KDE4FolderView.png
Course, this used to work much better under KDE3:
http://www.darose.net/KDE3QuickBrowser.png
I've got a bug filed to try to make KDE4 work the same way.
DR
Dave,
I have had knock-down drag out fights with the KDE4 devs over the loss of the ability to add a subtree of your menu to the kicker in KDE4. The only problem I have with folderview to desktop files is you have lost the ability to expand into subfolders. I have a folderview in my kicker, but honestly after using the little icons in quick launch for a while -- and having all 22 of my favorites without the need to open a menu -- it kind of grows on you after a while ;-).
We WILL get the subtree option back at some point in the future. Here is the relevant post from the suse list:
<quote>
Listmates,
A big thanks to Will Stephenson for putting aside all the issues, shouldering the load, and doing the hard work of making kde4 better. Thanks.
Bug https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=189583 is a case-study in all that is wrong with the kde4 bug reporting/fixing process. It somewhat uncomfortably shows a number of the obstacles that each kde4 bug must overcome before it can be resolved. (None of which are related to source code editing, compilation or debugging)
For nearly a year the biggest hang-up this bug faced was the petty infighting by a few of the kde devs over whether to classify this missing kde4 feature as a "Wish" or a "Bug" --- please...
Will finally waded in, took the reins, and got the job done. I haven't had the time to test it yet, but regardless, getting anything with kde4 fixed has seemed more a fist-fight and been more painful than sticking bamboo under your fingernails. It is like a breath of fresh air to see progress being made. Thanks Will, Sven, Stephan, Dotan and the rest of the kde4 folks I can't even begin to recall, for you tireless effort. KDE4 is getting there.
</quote>
On 10/23/2009 03:25 AM, David C. Rankin wrote:
Dave,
I have had knock-down drag out fights with the KDE4 devs over the loss of the ability to add a subtree of your menu to the kicker in KDE4. The only problem I have with folderview to desktop files is you have lost the ability to expand into subfolders. I have a folderview in my kicker, but honestly after using the little icons in quick launch for a while -- and having all 22 of my favorites without the need to open a menu -- it kind of grows on you after a while ;-).
We WILL get the subtree option back at some point in the future. Here is the relevant post from the suse list:
Ugh.
I'm starting to feel like KDE has "jumped the shark". :-)
DR
On Friday 23 October 2009 11:19:28 am David Rosenstrauch wrote:
We WILL get the subtree option back at some point in the future. Here is the relevant post from the suse list:
Ugh.
I'm starting to feel like KDE has "jumped the shark". :-)
If I follow you correctly -- I agree, and when it did, it got a mouth full of big, nasty, long, sharp teeth eating its a$$ up... :-)
Honestly, I think it is KDE's programming framework that has caused most of the problems. While the kparts toolkits provides an easy framework, it inevitably leads to a one size fits all mentality to application design where everything is shoe-horned into the chosen framework. Not to mention code bloat for smaller apps (did I mention the 285k "hello world" dialog?) It will all work once all the 'oopses' have been eliminated, but until then, any weak link in the chain really impacts a lot of stuff (thus the teeth adjectives above :)
For fun, see the "hello world" tutorial here:
http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials#Introduction_To_KDE_4_Programm...
On 10/26/2009 12:53 PM, David C. Rankin wrote:
Honestly, I think it is KDE's programming framework that has caused most of the problems.
I disagree. The problems (at least from my perspective) stems from the KDE devs' decision to "start fresh" with all their apps in order to "simplify" them and/or apply their new philosophy/approach of desktop GUI design to them.
That decision resulted in them dumping loads of features from out of their apps - features that many KDE3 users liked and relied on. The result has been a less-useful and less-productive GUI.
So really more of a problem with fundamental design decisions, IMO, than with their programming framework.
DR
On Monday 26 October 2009 13:34:43 and regarding:
I disagree. The problems (at least from my perspective) stems from the KDE devs' decision to "start fresh" with all their apps in order to "simplify" them and/or apply their new philosophy/approach of desktop GUI design to them.
That decision resulted in them dumping loads of features from out of their apps - features that many KDE3 users liked and relied on. The result has been a less-useful and less-productive GUI.
So really more of a problem with fundamental design decisions, IMO, than with their programming framework.
From that perspective I completely agree. Konqueror is the perfect example. An elegant, very functional file manager (wannabe browser) that was packed with tons of advanced features with a -->very<-- efficient UI (from a minimal mouse-click/keystroke standpoint) with proper focus control that was completely thrown out and redone based on the new untried and untested dolphin engine. That has been a complete fiasco and left kde with a substandard file manager that has no ability to place focus without using a 2-part ctrl+click (with the cutsie green plus markers turned off)
The fish fiasco followed, and we could go on and on (162 bugs filed in the past 4 months alone...) My purpose of commenting on the framework comes from all of the problems the one-size-fits-all primary widget has caused getting things working correctly. Probably 1/4 of the bugs above are from misconfigured parts of the window widget that wipe out data if a change is made to a dialog, or those that don't retain path settings, etc.
So I guess when you take a working desktop and throw it out the window and then start over with an overly complex framework -- you have probably just signed up to shoot yourself in the foot :p
Have you guys ever heard of krunner? It really makes doing things and launching apparently easy. You don't really need icons to launch programs.
Also, I don't understand all of the dolphin detractors. I think dolphin is near file manager perfection. Always felt that konquorer was like a big incoherent blob. Dolphin will be feature complete soon and it will have paid off to start over.
Rob
On Nov 11, 2009 8:42 AM, "David C. Rankin" drankinatty@suddenlinkmail.com wrote:
On Monday 26 October 2009 13:34:43 and regarding:
I disagree. The problems (at least from my perspective) stems from the >
KDE devs' decision to "...
From that perspective I completely agree. Konqueror is the perfect example.
An elegant, very functional file manager (wannabe browser) that was packed with tons of advanced features with a -->very<-- efficient UI (from a minimal mouse-click/keystroke standpoint) with proper focus control that was completely thrown out and redone based on the new untried and untested dolphin engine. That has been a complete fiasco and left kde with a substandard file manager that has no ability to place focus without using a 2-part ctrl+click (with the cutsie green plus markers turned off)
The fish fiasco followed, and we could go on and on (162 bugs filed in the past 4 months alone...) My purpose of commenting on the framework comes from all of the problems the one-size-fits-all primary widget has caused getting things working correctly. Probably 1/4 of the bugs above are from misconfigured parts of the window widget that wipe out data if a change is made to a dialog, or those that don't retain path settings, etc.
So I guess when you take a working desktop and throw it out the window and then start over with an overly complex framework -- you have probably just signed up to shoot yourself in the foot :p
-- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961 ...
At Mittwoch, 11. November 2009 15:04 Robert Howard wrote:
Have you guys ever heard of krunner? It really makes doing things and launching apparently easy. You don't really need icons to launch programs.
Krunner is very nice but for me it is more a replacement for katapult which i used under kd3 than something extra.
Also, I don't understand all of the dolphin detractors. I think dolphin is near file manager perfection. Always felt that konquorer was like a big incoherent blob. Dolphin will be feature complete soon and it will have paid off to start over.
If i will get even 1 Dollar for every "but with the next release all will be complete" in combination with KDE4 than this will be very nice for me.-)
One question about dolphin: Why is F4 hardcoded to the Terminal Emulator instead of as before (or still now) with konqueror? Without konqueror and without kde3 perhaps dolphin could be good file manager but in comparison to it for me never.-)
Just for the stats (and to say some positive thing too): Now at the moment the Perfomance of KDE4 is realy good.
See you, Attila
On 11/11/2009 08:41 AM, David C. Rankin wrote:
On Monday 26 October 2009 13:34:43 and regarding:
I disagree. The problems (at least from my perspective) stems from the KDE devs' decision to "start fresh" with all their apps in order to "simplify" them and/or apply their new philosophy/approach of desktop GUI design to them.
That decision resulted in them dumping loads of features from out of their apps - features that many KDE3 users liked and relied on. The result has been a less-useful and less-productive GUI.
So really more of a problem with fundamental design decisions, IMO, than with their programming framework.
From that perspective I completely agree. Konqueror is the perfect example. An elegant, very functional file manager (wannabe browser) that was packed with tons of advanced features with a -->very<-- efficient UI (from a minimal mouse-click/keystroke standpoint) with proper focus control that was completely thrown out and redone based on the new untried and untested dolphin engine. That has been a complete fiasco and left kde with a substandard file manager that has no ability to place focus without using a 2-part ctrl+click (with the cutsie green plus markers turned off)
Huh. I wasn't aware of the issues with Dolphin ... because I'm still using Konqueror for my file manager! :-)
It's funny too - even though I'd say I'm now a very happy Xfce user, I still don't use Thunar. Konqueror - with all the KIO network file system plugins - is just such an incredibly useful and productive tool that no other file manager even comes close IMO. The power of being able to do things like transparently copy a file from one network box (using SSH/fish) to another network box (using SAMBA/smb) - all from the same file manager app, and without having to issue any mount commands - is just incredible. These capabilities have pretty much raised the bar on what I expect from a file manager nowadays, and Thunar unfortunately pales in comparison as a result.
So I guess when you take a working desktop and throw it out the window and then start over with an overly complex framework -- you have probably just signed up to shoot yourself in the foot :p
That's how I see it. And - although I often disagree with him - "Joel on Software" wrote a great (and correct, IMO) essay espousing this same view a while back too: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000069.html
DR
arch-general@lists.archlinux.org