Jonathan Vasquez [2011.12.22 1128 -0500]:

It's posted on the main page :) On Dec 22, 2011 11:27 AM, "David C. Rankin" wrote:

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Guys,

Just a quick question. Upgrade failed due to conflict with mtab:

<snip> (67/67) checking for file conflicts [#######################################] 100% error: failed to commit transaction (conflicting files) filesystem: /etc/mtab exists in filesystem Errors occurred, no packages were upgraded.

How should I handle this? I don't think it would be a good idea to replace an active mtab with --force. What say the experts?

-- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E.

Slightly OT: Interestingly enough, I did exactly what the news item says not to do: deleted the mtab file and then ran pacman -Suy. This didn't cause any trouble at my end. N. -- () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 22/12/11 14:40, David C. Rankin wrote:

On 12/22/2011 11:19 AM, Angel Velásquez wrote:

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The experts, normal people, and even noobs like me would say to you .. PLEASE READ THE NEWS DUDE, (its like the 5th time you write a mail asking questions, when the solution it's posted on the front page)..

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Don't you think you're big enough to learn this amazing trick?

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Geez....

Johnathan responded in a civil helpful tone. You would do well to learn from his example.

Yes he did a top-posty e-mail (again showing that people doesn't fit well with the netetiquette) that was useful to you. I think he will do that until the day that he will realize that you're always asking this kind of questions (solved questions that you're lazy to look). Why don't you reconsider to stop asking before read the whole website?, the rest of the people is beging you to do it!. This is not your first, second or third time you have done this, remember that you have asked solved stuff several times. I'm being uncivil with you, because you finished my patience level, and it's untolerable to get mails from you everytime you can't look the website. Instead of acusing me of being uncivil, I hope you learn the lesson, it's not so hard, and i'm confident you can. This is the correct workflow before you ask: 1) archlinux.org 2) if !1 .. www.google.com 3) if !2 bbs.archlinux.org or this list Please reconsider your asking workflow, you can't hope for civilized answers when the answer is there but you're to lazy to give a look, and give us a mail breaking our balls... But don't worry, now i've added you to a special label and your mails are automatically moved to trash. Thanks for wasting our time. Oh btw, i've said the same to you before, in a civilized way and you didn't replied or ignored, I'm being civilized in this e-mail again (being honest doesn't make me uncivilized) .. so I hope you get the point. Thanks. - -- Angel Velásquez angvp @ irc.freenode.net Arch Linux Developer / Trusted User Linux Counter: #359909 http://www.angvp.com -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJO83B3AAoJEEKh2xXsEzutbUQH/3LnJeF2CMfKJkpglcHR2AdO 841R/D65ywgym7Os0gz99jqWETATPUYPcvWI66KansgKvjAAHyYGghQ0PiRt8Rau WnYQjUIGELa6mhcmuxtNPKFfZjlahyqfn5Wih4lijA7G6Jnn6AVs+fy8yTwcCn+0 JeCXXDOTmM1dC3BP0b+VL+iS4Fk27H5ZeyLRatKlfKoX8eyJkHdRuW3/SgY9Ks7Q XTehH/aXCHEawbPrOsPF2VIzPbLzrfguw0M3sl6KhGuIcc1C3F/BMnu2SJN0mhXY DgIzh8vKJOvP8Yl7+/7blr5EhA59UvRtBBMwjDv4HfuVO6816m8J/zmFK0FY7nM= =GCRT -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On 12/22/2011 07:23 PM, Vitor Eiji Justus Sakaguti wrote:

2011/12/22 Angel Velásquez:

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On 22/12/11 14:40, David C. Rankin wrote:

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On 12/22/2011 11:19 AM, Angel Velásquez wrote:

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The experts, normal people, and even noobs like me would say to you .. PLEASE READ THE NEWS DUDE, (its like the 5th time you write a mail asking questions, when the solution it's posted on the front page).. Don't you think you're big enough to learn this amazing trick? Geez.... Johnathan responded in a civil helpful tone. You would do well to learn from his example.

Yes he did a top-posty e-mail (again showing that people doesn't fit well with the netetiquette) that was useful to you. I think he will do that until the day that he will realize that you're always asking this kind of questions (solved questions that you're lazy to look).

Why don't you reconsider to stop asking before read the whole website?, the rest of the people is beging you to do it!. This is not your first, second or third time you have done this, remember that you have asked solved stuff several times.

I'm being uncivil with you, because you finished my patience level, and it's untolerable to get mails from you everytime you can't look the website.

Instead of acusing me of being uncivil, I hope you learn the lesson, it's not so hard, and i'm confident you can.

This is the correct workflow before you ask:

1) archlinux.org 2) if !1 .. www.google.com 3) if !2 bbs.archlinux.org or this list

Please reconsider your asking workflow, you can't hope for civilized answers when the answer is there but you're to lazy to give a look, and give us a mail breaking our balls...

But don't worry, now i've added you to a special label and your mails are automatically moved to trash. Thanks for wasting our time.

Oh btw, i've said the same to you before, in a civilized way and you didn't replied or ignored, I'm being civilized in this e-mail again (being honest doesn't make me uncivilized) .. so I hope you get the point.

Thanks. +1. +1 And if you're to lazy to check the site at least subscribe to the arch-announce mailing list. Answers to questions like this are than send to you completely free of charge wihtout you have to do any real effort for it.

Alex

Or maybe try using pacmatic: http://www.archlinux.org/packages/community/any/pacmatic/

+1 I strongly suggest to the OP the use of pacmatic [1]. It's really an useful tool, especially if you don't check regularly the news (as you should). [1] http://kmkeen.com/pacmatic/ Regards, Lorenzo -- Nothing is interesting if you're not interested.

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This is the correct workflow before you ask:

1) archlinux.org 2) if !1 .. www.google.com 3) if !2 bbs.archlinux.org or this list

It's amasing how often I see this on all > medium volume lists. You have to reply to the reply of every message you send to the qmail list as an antispam measure. The same system could ask users to check for an answer, but maybe that would be even more annoying for frequent responders. I guess it could ask for the first twenty times but that would require modifying the code.

The 22/12/11, Angel Velásquez wrote:

The experts, normal people, and even noobs like me would say to you .. PLEASE READ THE NEWS DUDE, (its like the 5th time you write a mail asking questions, when the solution it's posted on the front page)..

Don't you think you're big enough to learn this amazing trick?

OTOH, news related to updates are *not* at the correct place on the home web page. When I do admin tasks I would expect to read news in my _shell_ just before the update. Also, think that the packages updates might be later done offline after a refresh & downloadonly. People at Gentoo did a good tool exactly for this purpose: (shell prompt) # eselect news Usage: eselect news <action> <options> Standard actions: help Display help text usage Display usage information version Display version information Extra actions: count Display number of news items new Count unread news items (default) all Count all news items list List news items purge Purge read news read <item>... Read news items --mbox Output in mbox format --quiet Suppress output, only change status --raw Output in raw format new Read unread news items (default) all Read all news items item Number of item (from 'list' action) unread <item>... Mark read news items as unread again all Mark all news items as unread item Number of item (from 'list' action) # News sample: (shell prompt) # eselect news read 2 2010-03-25-python-3.1 Title Python 3.1 Author Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis Posted 2010-03-25 Revision 1 Python 3 is a new major version of Python and is intentionally incompatible with Python 2. Many external modules have not been ported yet to Python 3, so Python 2 still needs to be installed. You can benefit from having Python 3 installed without setting Python 3.1 as main active version of Python. Currently you should not set Python 3.1 as main active version of Python. When setting it becomes recommended, a separate news item will be created to notify users. Although Python 3.1 should not be set as main active version of Python, you should run python-updater after installation of Python 3.1. By default, modules that support both Python 2 and Python 3 are installed for both the active version of Python 2 and the active version of Python 3 when both Python 2 and Python 3 are installed. It is recommended to use a UTF-8 locale to avoid potential problems. Especially C and POSIX locales are discouraged. If locale has not been explicitly set, then POSIX locale is used, so you should ensure that locale has been set. Problems occurring only with non-UTF-8 locales should be reported directly to upstream developers of given packages. See http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/utf-8.xml for more information about UTF-8. With 'eselect news read' you only get fresh news you didn't read yet. This feature was a big success, very appreciated by users. -- Nicolas Sebrecht

On Dec 23, 2011 5:43 PM, "Ralf Madorf" wrote:

On Fri, 2011-12-23 at 10:22 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:

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The 22/12/11, Angel Velásquez wrote:

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The experts, normal people, and even noobs like me would say to you .. PLEASE READ THE NEWS DUDE, (its like the 5th time you write a mail asking questions, when the solution it's posted on the front page)..

Don't you think you're big enough to learn this amazing trick?

OTOH, news related to updates are *not* at the correct place on the home web page. When I do admin tasks I would expect to read news in my _shell_ just before the update.

+1

Some news might be no news anymore, it's not for everybody useful to upgrade the Linux very often.

Then perhaps there are better distros to use then Arch for the purpose

I got all upgrade information using Google e.g. linked to the news. Anyway I wonder why people aren't allowed to ask every question. There were not hundred people asking about mtab at this list, just one person and this person might have missed the information by the news.

Perhaps looking at the person's prior posting history would be a good idea. This wasn't a frivolous complaint made randomly.

Am 23.12.2011 11:29, schrieb Alexander van den Berghe:

On 12/23/2011 10:43 AM, Ralf Madorf wrote:

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On Fri, 2011-12-23 at 10:22 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:

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The 22/12/11, Angel Velásquez wrote:

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The experts, normal people, and even noobs like me would say to you .. PLEASE READ THE NEWS DUDE, (its like the 5th time you write a mail asking questions, when the solution it's posted on the front page)..

Don't you think you're big enough to learn this amazing trick? OTOH, news related to updates are *not* at the correct place on the home web page. When I do admin tasks I would expect to read news in my _shell_ just before the update. +1

Some news might be no news anymore, it's not for everybody useful to upgrade the Linux very often. For such people it is not advised to use a rolling release distribution such as Arch. Using Arch without updating often enough is asking for problems. I got all upgrade information using Google e.g. linked to the news. Anyway I wonder why people aren't allowed to ask every question. There were not hundred people asking about mtab at this list, just one person and this person might have missed the information by the news.

I read tons of threads on Arch forums and I had to read hundreds of times replies saying "use Google", "search the Wiki", "search the forum" + tons of misinformation from experts aka moderators, since they sometimes not really experts for everything.

- Ralf

It is frustrating for people to see the same questions asked over and over. Especially while the solution can be easily found on the home page, wiki or forums. These kind of questions just pollute the medium through which they where asked with noise, which makes it more difficult to find the good information.

Alex

maybe not the right place here, but has to be mentioned IMHO: the search restriction for the forum at archlinux.org is really annnoying. i like doing intense research before asking, but the one-search-per-minuite limit (or something about that) is making that difficoult for me. ok, there are good reasons for that as well, but annoying anyways…

On Fri, 2011-12-23 at 12:21 +0100, Ralf Madorf wrote:

On Fri, 2011-12-23 at 11:53 +0100, G. Schlisio wrote:

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maybe not the right place here, but has to be mentioned IMHO: the search restriction for the forum at archlinux.org is really annnoying. i like doing intense research before asking, but the one-search-per-minuite limit (or something about that) is making that difficoult for me. ok, there are good reasons for that as well, but annoying anyways…

Use Google, even if you don't like Google and add something similar to "arch linux users list archive" to your search.

PS: Resp. "forum" instead of "archive" etc..

Am 23.12.2011 12:38, schrieb Oon-Ee Ng:

On Dec 23, 2011 7:21 PM, "Ralf Madorf" wrote:

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On Fri, 2011-12-23 at 11:53 +0100, G. Schlisio wrote:

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maybe not the right place here, but has to be mentioned IMHO: the search restriction for the forum at archlinux.org is really annnoying. i like doing intense research before asking, but the one-search-per-minuite limit (or something about that) is making that difficoult for me. ok, there are good reasons for that as well, but annoying anyways… Use Google, even if you don't like Google and add something similar to "arch linux users list archive" to your search.

Or just use site:archlinux.org

ok, thats what i do anyways. but why then we need the own search? nah, no big diskussion needed now. merry chrimas!