Dear list, even after reading all wiki and man, I am still confused about how to write locale.conf after recent upgrades. Here are the 6 locales enabled in locale.gen: fr_CH.UTF-8 UTF-8 fr_CH ISO-8859-1 fr_FR.UTF-8 UTF-8 fr_FR ISO-8859-1 fr_FR@euro ISO-8859-15 en_US.UTF-8 UTF-8 en_US ISO-8859-1 My Arch is in english, and I live in Switzerland and read documents in english, french and "swiss" french. Still, I am not sure if I need to enable all these locales. I have NO IDEA how to write correctly all these locales in locale.conf. Thank you for your help. Regards.
2012/8/1 Arno Gaboury <arnaud.gaboury@gmail.com>:
Dear list,
even after reading all wiki and man, I am still confused about how to write locale.conf after recent upgrades. Here are the 6 locales enabled in locale.gen: fr_CH.UTF-8 UTF-8 fr_CH ISO-8859-1 fr_FR.UTF-8 UTF-8 fr_FR ISO-8859-1 fr_FR@euro ISO-8859-15 en_US.UTF-8 UTF-8 en_US ISO-8859-1
My Arch is in english, and I live in Switzerland and read documents in english, french and "swiss" french. Still, I am not sure if I need to enable all these locales.
I have NO IDEA how to write correctly all these locales in locale.conf.
Thank you for your help.
Regards.
If you want to have a french speaking system, just set up you locale.conf this way : LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C An english speaking system ? LANG= en_US.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C Hope it helps :) And don't forget to run locale-gen in order to get locale files generated. -- Frederic Bezies fredbezies@gmail.com
Am 01.08.2012 13:16, schrieb fredbezies:
LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C
An english speaking system ?
LANG= en_US.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C
I don't know why you set it, but I find LC_COLLATE=C extremely annoying. If you want an English speaking system, but live in Switzerland, I recommend this: LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Thomas Bächler <thomas@archlinux.org> wrote:
LANG= en_US.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C
I don't know why you set it, but I find LC_COLLATE=C extremely annoying.
One possible reason is that asciibetical sorting causes e.g. files named "_foo" or "[foo]" to be sorted before all other items, which some people might be relying on. Meanwhile, locale sorting ignores the non-alphanumeric prefix. But I can definitely see how it can be annoying: I want "Ą" to be sorted between "A" and "B" where it belongs [in my language anyway], and the C collation would put all accented letters after "Z", which is ... not very useful. -- Mantas Mikulėnas
Am Wed, 01 Aug 2012 14:10:14 +0200 schrieb Thomas Bächler <thomas@archlinux.org>:
I don't know why you set it, but I find LC_COLLATE=C extremely annoying.
If you want an English speaking system, but live in Switzerland, I recommend this:
LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8
You should be careful with LC_MESSAGES if you use desktop environments which don't have their own language setting like Xfce. They use LC_MESSAGES to set their language. Means if you're e.g. in Germany, use Xfce and have this locale.conf as it is recommended in man locale.conf: LANG=de_DE.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=C Then you get a fully English system. The same with: LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8 I would recommend to just set LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 in locale.conf. If you really need an English output on the console, e.g. for filing bug reports, I would recommend to set LC_MESSAGES explicitly each time you really need it: LC_MESSAGES=C command-to-be-executed Heiko
Am 01.08.2012 14:35, schrieb Heiko Baums:
Am Wed, 01 Aug 2012 14:10:14 +0200 schrieb Thomas Bächler <thomas@archlinux.org>:
I don't know why you set it, but I find LC_COLLATE=C extremely annoying.
If you want an English speaking system, but live in Switzerland, I recommend this:
LANG=fr_CH.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8
You should be careful with LC_MESSAGES if you use desktop environments which don't have their own language setting like Xfce.
?????
They use LC_MESSAGES to set their language.
Of course, that's the point of LC_MESSAGES. What else would it do?
Am Wed, 01 Aug 2012 14:48:02 +0200 schrieb Thomas Bächler <thomas@archlinux.org>:
You should be careful with LC_MESSAGES if you use desktop environments which don't have their own language setting like Xfce.
?????
I know that you're using KDE, if you haven't switched in the meantime. ;-) So, KDE uses its own language setting and doesn't care about the LANG and LC_* variables. Xfce doesn't have its own language setting and uses LC_MESSAGES - unfortunately not LANG - to set the language of the desktop. Maybe I should file a bug report or feature request to upstream.
They use LC_MESSAGES to set their language.
Of course, that's the point of LC_MESSAGES. What else would it do?
Well, actually I would expect that the language is set by LANG and not by LC_MESSAGES. I would expect, and I guess this is what it's meant for, that just the output on stdout or stderr is affected by LC_MESSAGES. That is, that LC_MESSAGES only sets the console output of CLI programs, but not the language of the whole desktop environment like Xfce and all the GUI programs. What was the sense of LANG otherwise? Heiko
On Thu, Aug 2, 2012 at 1:06 AM, Heiko Baums <lists@baums-on-web.de> wrote:
Well, actually I would expect that the language is set by LANG and not by LC_MESSAGES. I would expect, and I guess this is what it's meant for, that just the output on stdout or stderr is affected by LC_MESSAGES. That is, that LC_MESSAGES only sets the console output of CLI programs, but not the language of the whole desktop environment like Xfce and all the GUI programs. What was the sense of LANG otherwise?
LANG simply acts as the /default value/ for all LC_* settings, so that you don't need to set 12 identical variables. LC_MESSAGES, as well as other LC_* variables, should have the same effect everywhere. -- Mantas Mikulėnas
On Thu, Aug 2, 2012 at 12:06 AM, Heiko Baums <lists@baums-on-web.de> wrote:
Of course, that's the point of LC_MESSAGES. What else would it do?
Well, actually I would expect that the language is set by LANG and not by LC_MESSAGES. I would expect, and I guess this is what it's meant for, that just the output on stdout or stderr is affected by LC_MESSAGES. That is, that LC_MESSAGES only sets the console output of CLI programs, but not the language of the whole desktop environment like Xfce and all the GUI programs. What was the sense of LANG otherwise?
It makes sense to me that any text is in whatever locale LC_MESSAGES specifes, regardless of where it is being printed. The point of LANG is to be a default for all the LC_* variables that are not set. The exception is LC_ALL which overrides everything, and is (afaik) only meant to be set at runtime for debugging purposes. -t
ke, 2012-08-01 kello 13:12 +0200, Arno Gaboury kirjoitti:
My Arch is in english, and I live in Switzerland and read documents in english, french and "swiss" french. Still, I am not sure if I need to enable all these locales.
You do not need any of the ISO-8859-X locales, UTF-8 ons are enought. Also you can probably disable en_US completely. Most applications use english as the build in locale (locale C), so there is no need to enable it, as faar as I have understood.
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Jesse Juhani Jaara <jesse.jaara@gmail.com> wrote:
Also you can probably disable en_US completely. Most applications use english as the build in locale (locale C), so there is no need to enable it, as faar as I have understood.
This is right, but the "C" locale uses US-ASCII, not UTF-8 (although Debian has "C.UTF-8"). So I would /not/ recommend setting "C" as $LANG. (Or as anything else, except $LC_COLLATE). -- Mantas Mikulėnas
On 01/08/12||14:46, Mantas Mikulėnas wrote:
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Jesse Juhani Jaara <jesse.jaara@gmail.com> wrote:
Also you can probably disable en_US completely. Most applications use english as the build in locale (locale C), so there is no need to enable it, as faar as I have understood.
This is right, but the "C" locale uses US-ASCII, not UTF-8 (although Debian has "C.UTF-8").
So I would /not/ recommend setting "C" as $LANG. (Or as anything else, except $LC_COLLATE).
-- Mantas Mikulėnas
OK, thnak you for your answer. I thought I had to write more lines in locale.conf because of all my locale.gen. So I sticked to basic : LANG=en_US.UTF8 LC_COLLATE=C As suggested, I commented in locale.gen all ISO files, except the one with the euro symbol, and decided to let english. Regards.
On 01-08-2012 13:09, Arno Gaboury wrote:
On 01/08/12||14:46, Mantas Mikulėnas wrote:
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Jesse Juhani Jaara <jesse.jaara@gmail.com> wrote:
Also you can probably disable en_US completely. Most applications use english as the build in locale (locale C), so there is no need to enable it, as faar as I have understood.
This is right, but the "C" locale uses US-ASCII, not UTF-8 (although Debian has "C.UTF-8").
So I would /not/ recommend setting "C" as $LANG. (Or as anything else, except $LC_COLLATE).
-- Mantas Mikulėnas
OK, thnak you for your answer. I thought I had to write more lines in locale.conf because of all my locale.gen. So I sticked to basic : LANG=en_US.UTF8 LC_COLLATE=C
As suggested, I commented in locale.gen all ISO files, except the one with the euro symbol, and decided to let english.
Regards.
Unless I forgot to read some post I guess no one stated what seems to me to be the most straightforward way of doing it. If you have your system working to your preference (before having anything in locale.conf), check the output of 'locale' and copy it to locale.conf. -- Mauro Santos
On 01/08/12||14:11, Mauro Santos wrote:
On 01-08-2012 13:09, Arno Gaboury wrote:
On 01/08/12||14:46, Mantas Mikulėnas wrote:
On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 2:17 PM, Jesse Juhani Jaara <jesse.jaara@gmail.com> wrote:
Also you can probably disable en_US completely. Most applications use english as the build in locale (locale C), so there is no need to enable it, as faar as I have understood.
This is right, but the "C" locale uses US-ASCII, not UTF-8 (although Debian has "C.UTF-8").
So I would /not/ recommend setting "C" as $LANG. (Or as anything else, except $LC_COLLATE).
-- Mantas Mikulėnas
OK, thnak you for your answer. I thought I had to write more lines in locale.conf because of all my locale.gen. So I sticked to basic : LANG=en_US.UTF8 LC_COLLATE=C
As suggested, I commented in locale.gen all ISO files, except the one with the euro symbol, and decided to let english.
Regards.
Unless I forgot to read some post I guess no one stated what seems to me to be the most straightforward way of doing it.
If you have your system working to your preference (before having anything in locale.conf), check the output of 'locale' and copy it to locale.conf.
-- Mauro Santos
Mauro, you are right as I am still confused! Most of my readings let me to just write: LANG=en_US.UTF8 LC_COLLATE=C But by curiousity, I am now trying LANG=fr_CH.UTF8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8 and will see in the coming days if any issue arrise. I thought the answer to my question would be more trivial, but I was wrong! Thank you again. Regards.
participants (8)
-
Arno Gaboury
-
fredbezies
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Heiko Baums
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Jesse Juhani Jaara
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Mantas Mikulėnas
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Mauro Santos
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Thomas Bächler
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Tom Gundersen