On 10/27/2011 12:14 PM, Martti Kühne wrote:
On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 6:24 PM, Leonid Isaevlisaev@umail.iu.edu wrote:
OK, which update you are talking about?
Shutdown problems probably come from upower. Your user would loose control of external devices only if you were in the storage/disk groups. Adding youself to these groups was your mistake, since unless you understand what you are doing, you should let console-kit do the permission granting. In fact, on a modern linux system you only have to be a member of 1 group: users.
How do you start your desktop and do you have ck-launch-session running?
Personally I'm not using neither gui file browser nor consolekit session and make use of the group based permission because I know how to handle things, and I can look up eventual barriers in my way quickly and reliably enough. I mount usb drives manually and generally lay hands on my system to keep things running, I mean, in a sane way. This is the first time I hear that this way of treating things would be discouraged, and I'm asking myself if this is just a sysadmin's gripe and if it will be possible in the future. Let's say I'm pretty sure it will be possible, since I guess I'm not the only one who avoids these additional sources of errors aka. software layers like ck/dbus/stuff. I left $certain-other-distro for some reason, and don't want to be forced back on this layer cake again.
the sources of error are likely not a thin smear of software that, imo, makes the entire experience much better and enables fine-grained access control ... i mean group perms are nice and all, but they are incredibly coarse, and over the years have forced all sorts of odd/convoluted application hierarchies + access patterns to cope.
unfortunately, error sources are probably human, ie. stuff isn't being launched/ran/used properly. the stack is layers -- i for one think the linux experience has improved 1000 fold over the last few years alone -- and we continue to demand more, albeit indirectly at times.
Also reminds me of this morning's xorg-xdm bug report I wrote which made dbus on a system level necessary, all of a sudden... Things go on like this and I'll remove my Xorg and run frambuffer only from now on. :-)
doubtful ;-). im a professional sysadmin too ATM (though, i'm traditionally an applications developer, and am trying my hand at larger scale administration), and honestly, i'd like to see dbus and other tools that enhance discovery/transparency/communication/free-time embed themselves like a tick in everything possible. this idea of actually *wanting* to micromanage everything makes me shudder ... yuck ... the cleanest fastest version with a healthy scoop of Just Works beats uber-unnecessary flexibility any day in my book.
there are more interesting problems to solve than helping my computer be a computer.