[aur-general] trusted users business

Sat Jul 17 10:49:11 EDT 2010

On Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 8:18 AM, Loui Chang <louipc.ist at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri 16 Jul 2010 10:14 -0300, Angel Velásquez wrote:
>> On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 8:36 PM, Loui Chang <louipc.ist at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Thu 15 Jul 2010 14:11 -0300, Angel Velásquez wrote:
>> >> 2010/7/15 Angel Velásquez <angvp at archlinux.com.ve>:
>> >> >
>> >> > So let's start the removal procedure for swiergot (who is pretty
>> >> > dissapeared).
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Removal procedure is started, swiergot downgraded as a Normal User for
>> >> keep sure that he won't vote (Removal procedure states that a TU can't
>> >> vote against him).
>> >
>> > You are wrong to start this removal process. None of those Trusted Users
>> > have prevented quorum from being met yet. Please reverse your actions.
>> >
>> > If you do want to remove them, you should offer some other reason and we
>> > need to vote on it, or we could vote on a change to the bylaws to
>> > redefine inactivity.
>>
>> Bah, I should vote for a change the bylaws, I missunderstood what I
>> quoted before (Isaac's did a good point).
>>
>> Facts are (speaking generally):
>>
>> a) Removal of a TU is very hard, (even if he/she or they aren't doing
>> anything), we should need some 'automatic way' or .. less bereucratic
>> way to do that.
>
> Removing a TU is not any harder than adding a TU, do you propose that we
> can remove TUs willy-nilly without votes? I don't agree with that idea.

We discuss it, on IRC there was 5 tu online at that moment, I said "I
will start the votation of removal", nobody told me anything, they let
me go in fact I did two mistakes, i put 7 days, and gang told me "hey
pal is just 5 days"... we all missunderstood it, but my point is, why
we have to discuss it so long?.. it's just a barrier, for example at
today (two days after) the guy is still dissapeared (what is his
timezone -48 ?), I remember you again, we did the votation process
(it's running as you see .. obviously is invalid ATM), we just skip
the discussion about his removal because we though that it was
automatically, that's it.. isn't automatically, good .. so for that
moment, is started the discussion process ... will see on the next
week, I hope somebody will be in charge of creating the votation
process or something, not me again, thanks.

And about the automatic removal.. If a people isn't doing anything ..
and he's dissapeared, wait for 7 days ... discussing what? the process
of discussion should be short IMO (three days is enough).. and when
the facts are heavy like .. 0 packages in AUR ... in community is
everything almost out of date and have workload on TODO from more than
2 months ago and he isn't marked as inactive.. is unresponsability and
disrespect with the rest of the team... in those cases, I think
discussion .. is beurecratic, he should will start to a votation
process directly ... but .. that's it.. is just my opinion, and I
don't want to discuss it in this thread. (we are talking about TU
duties not about bylaws), and I know that I can propose something
better and you can vote to accept or it, but ... no thanks, is hard to
make happy too much people, I just share my opinion, I dislike
un-responsible/slacker people, that's it, there's a life, everyone of
us have it, heavys or not, write two lines asking for some time.. is
less than 5 minutes (even writting as a turtle like 60 wpm or less).

>
>> b) TU System on AUR need so much code ... (it's very limited) and I
>> can't or edit/delete that votation progress. It's invalid, of course,
>> but at the system level isn't.
>
> That's fine. It's just a method to collect votes - nothing more really.
> We used to do it via the mailing list.

IIRC we werent TUs for those times :) (but I know it, I read the
history of the list, Im just poiting that *we* in this case is like ..
weird in our cases), but since that times, the TU system should be
improved ... As I said, *WE* should be thinking for patches :) (I can
point you because you're the AUR maintainer, but I know that there
more hands working on it... as the votation that **I (Angel 'angvp'
Velasquez')** started)

>
>> c) I've speaked on the IRC channel, which btw loui we always would
>> like to have you there (don't know why you don't like to enter or
>> randomly :P), so I missunderstood somepart of the bylaws as Isaac
>> pointed me, but nobody told me anything too.. so I am accepting my
>> fault, but maybe if you were on our irc channel, you can advice me
>> before to send the application etc etc.
>
> Yeah you should better familiarise yourself with the bylaws and ask for
> clarification if there's any misunderstanding.

As I said we were 5 TUs on the irc channel and nobody said something
they were ONLINE not IDLE, but, I know, I started the votation process
is my mistake, I am not justifying it, and you're pointing me without
know the whole situation, as I said, please join to the channel which
is private, and we can discuss our private stuff there, instead of
shooting and then aim.

>
>> We're waiting yet for a swiergot's response yet.. so if past 24 hours
>> of the last mail, he doesn't replied anything I will ask for his
>> removal (on the TU channel though, and oh, again, you Loui are invited
>> to join us!, we are so wonderful people there :D)
>
> Decision bearing discussion needs to be done over the mailing list, not
> IRC. We have TUs from all over the globe. IRC is not practical. People
> have to work or sleep at different times and may not be able to attend
> an IRC meeting.

It was an e-mail, then I said on IRC, and the mailing list that I was
starting the process.. then, almost like 1 hour ago it was.. Next
time, I let it go, really, in fact, I shouldn't start the process for
removal, I will let you decide what to do, and most important, I will
let you and the tu crew DO something about removal or not of these
people.

So, that's it, I'm accepting my mistake, not justifying it, but the
fact is, this guy is candidate for removal, leave it or take it, as I
said, is nothing personal with the guy, I almost know him, but I won't
do anything more for starting removal of anybody, if a votation
process is started I will vote, and that's my last word.

Good weekend, people!

-- 
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Arch Linux Developer / Trusted User
Linux Counter: #359909
http://www.angvp.com