[arch-general] Not a good time for ProAudio work? WAS: Panic - no sound devices after upgrade - Arch-general

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[arch-general] Not a good time for ProAudio work? WAS: Panic - no sound devices after upgrade

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Bernardo Barros

20 Jul 2011 20 Jul '11

10:06 p.m.

All those issues regarding sound cards and lv2 plug-ins right now. This all mean it will take time until Ardour3 (stable) come out and udev fixes and updates? I tried to figure out the differences between my fedora and arch boxes, I cound not find an easy explanation why the firewire soundcard works on fedora and not on arch. I tried different kernels (including lts), udevs and everything I could think of, including editing the rules.d folder. Or we can try some kind of concentrated effort to find and fix those problems (specially sound card problems) until they hit more users? Sorry, maybe that's just a couple of us, one or two people. I don't really know how many.

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Calvin Morrison

20 Jul 20 Jul

10:27 p.m.

On 20 July 2011 14:06, Bernardo Barros wrote:

...

All those issues regarding sound cards and lv2 plug-ins right now. This all mean it will take time until Ardour3 (stable) come out and udev fixes and updates?

I tried to figure out the differences between my fedora and arch boxes, I cound not find an easy explanation why the firewire soundcard works on fedora and not on arch. I tried different kernels (including lts), udevs and everything I could think of, including editing the rules.d folder.

Or we can try some kind of concentrated effort to find and fix those problems (specially sound card problems) until they hit more users?

Sorry, maybe that's just a couple of us, one or two people. I don't really know how many.

It's me too. I am not "pro" audio, but I dabble quite heavily in linux based audio (I don't think it's quite ready yet for production use) and I am really excited about ardour3, but right now we are kind of stuck. Hardware wise has been really good to me. But I definitely echo your concerns. Calvin Morrison

Ray Rashif

10:29 p.m.

New subject: [arch-general] [archaudio-discuss] Not a good time for ProAudio work? WAS: Panic - no sound devices after upgrade

On 21 July 2011 02:06, Bernardo Barros wrote:

...

All those issues regarding sound cards and lv2 plug-ins right now. This all mean it will take time until Ardour3 (stable) come out and udev fixes and updates?

Usual random Linux issue to me. Happened before, happening now, always happens :)

...

I tried to figure out the differences between my fedora and arch boxes, I cound not find an easy explanation why the firewire soundcard works on fedora and not on arch. I tried different kernels (including lts), udevs and everything I could think of, including editing the rules.d folder.

I still do not see a bug report (against ffado) for this! -- GPG/PGP ID: 8AADBB10

Tom Gundersen

11:45 p.m.

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 8:06 PM, Bernardo Barros wrote:

...

All those issues regarding sound cards and lv2 plug-ins right now. This all mean it will take time until Ardour3 (stable) come out and udev fixes and updates?

I tried to figure out the differences between my fedora and arch boxes, I cound not find an easy explanation why the firewire soundcard works on fedora and not on arch. I tried different kernels (including lts), udevs and everything I could think of, including editing the rules.d folder.

Or we can try some kind of concentrated effort to find and fix those problems (specially sound card problems) until they hit more users?

Sorry, maybe that's just a couple of us, one or two people. I don't really know how many.

Any help in finding bugs (audio or otherwise) in udev is greatly appreciated. Usually they are easy to fix once we have a report, the problem is finding people who can report and reproduce them. I had a look at the udev in fedora (rawhide) and it should be almost identical to what we have in testing. It would be useful to know exactly what versions you are using (the newer the better) on both Arch and Fedora of both udev and the kernel, as well as more details about your problems: Do you have missing devices? Are there any differences between the loaded modules in a working and a broken system? Can you find any udev or module related bugs in your logs or dmesg? A useful exercise is to do "modprobe -rv <relevant module> && modprobe -v <relevant module>" and look on the console as well as dmes. If you have a pinned down a bit what the problem is, then open a FS, if you are still lost feel free to ping me in #archlinux (I'm tomegun). Cheers, Tom

Ray Rashif

21 Jul 21 Jul

12:12 a.m.

On 21 July 2011 03:45, Tom Gundersen wrote:

...

If you have a pinned down a bit what the problem is, then open a FS, if you are still lost feel free to ping me in #archlinux (I'm tomegun).

And for a start, determine if the only difference between Fedora and Arch is some kind of firewire rules [1]. If that is the case, try place it [1] in /etc/udev/rules.d and see if things work. Remove any custom chmods on device nodes you might have added before. However, looking at their tree, they don't seem to provide any such ruleset. The following quote is from upstream ieee1394 documentation [2]: "For example, the Fedora Linux distribution currently contains a mechanism to add read and write permission for the locally logged in user to the ACLs of fw* files of some FireWire device types. To this end, recent udev releases have firewire subsystem rules in the file 70-acl.rules file." I have little idea what that refers to. [1] http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-multimedia/ffado.git;a=blob_plain;f=debian/60-f... [2] https://ieee1394.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Juju_Migration#Character_device_f... -- GPG/PGP ID: 8AADBB10

Philipp Überbacher

12:51 a.m.

New subject: [arch-general] Not a good time for ProAudio work? WAS: Panic - no sound devices after upgrade

Excerpts from Ray Rashif's message of 2011-07-20 22:12:40 +0200:

...

On 21 July 2011 03:45, Tom Gundersen wrote:

...
If you have a pinned down a bit what the problem is, then open a FS, if you are still lost feel free to ping me in #archlinux (I'm tomegun).

And for a start, determine if the only difference between Fedora and Arch is some kind of firewire rules [1]. If that is the case, try place it [1] in /etc/udev/rules.d and see if things work. Remove any custom chmods on device nodes you might have added before.

However, looking at their tree, they don't seem to provide any such ruleset. The following quote is from upstream ieee1394 documentation [2]:

"For example, the Fedora Linux distribution currently contains a mechanism to add read and write permission for the locally logged in user to the ACLs of fw* files of some FireWire device types. To this end, recent udev releases have firewire subsystem rules in the file 70-acl.rules file."

I have little idea what that refers to.

[1] http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-multimedia/ffado.git;a=blob_plain;f=debian/60-f... [2] https://ieee1394.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Juju_Migration#Character_device_f...

Because ACL was mentioned.. I recently helped someone to get jack running. The trouble he had was related to polkit in some way. I didn't investigate further, no idea whether he did, but I'll suggest testing with polkit disabled from now on.

Bernardo Barros

1:52 a.m.

Hi Tom, Thanks for the reply! Maybe it's not udev because the issue is not that the soundcard does not show up, it actually does. The problem is that JACK does not work with it. And also I downgrade udev at the time. The problem should be a fine-tuning somewhere At the time Fedora 15 was using udev 168 and Arch udev 171. I tested with Fedora 15, the MOTU UltraLite worked with ffado from svn (rev. 1985). I'm using Fedora for serious audio work since then. At the same machine, an updated Arch did not work. Then I tried to downgrade the kernel and udev packages, no luck. My USB card (Edirol pcr1) did not work either.

Philipp Überbacher

2:05 a.m.

New subject: [arch-general] Not a good time for ProAudio work? WAS: Panic - no sound devices after upgrade

Excerpts from Bernardo Barros's message of 2011-07-20 23:52:32 +0200:

...

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the reply!

Maybe it's not udev because the issue is not that the soundcard does not show up, it actually does. The problem is that JACK does not work with it. And also I downgrade udev at the time. The problem should be a fine-tuning somewhere

At the time Fedora 15 was using udev 168 and Arch udev 171.

I tested with Fedora 15, the MOTU UltraLite worked with ffado from svn (rev. 1985). I'm using Fedora for serious audio work since then.

At the same machine, an updated Arch did not work. Then I tried to downgrade the kernel and udev packages, no luck. My USB card (Edirol pcr1) did not work either.

Maybe it's due something else in the init scripts, there were quite some changes afaik. I'm not sure which packages might be most relevant, I also don't know what you upgraded. Finding that out would be a first step. Guesses wrt. packages: initscripts, hwdetetct, mkinitcpio, kernel

Cédric Girard

2:22 a.m.

At least the problem is not generalized. I've just bring up to date my Arch Linux on the computer where my M-Audio Firewire Solo is plugged. Everything works as usual using libffado and jack2 from the official repo. -- Cédric Girard

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participants (6)

Bernardo Barros
Calvin Morrison
Cédric Girard
Philipp Überbacher
Ray Rashif
Tom Gundersen