Re: [arch-general] [arch-dev-public] Chromium losing Sync support on March 15
---------------------------------------- From: Levente Polyak via arch-dev-public <arch-dev-public@lists.archlinux.org> Sent: Tue Jan 26 22:18:21 CET 2021 To: <arch-dev-public@lists.archlinux.org> Cc: Levente Polyak <anthraxx@archlinux.org> Subject: Re: [arch-dev-public] Chromium losing Sync support on March 15
On 1/26/21 9:53 PM, Morten Linderud via arch-dev-public wrote:
It's dissapointing frankly.
Disappointing doesn't really catch it tho. If it would be just about the sync functionality: so be it. But crippling the API usage on a level that rips out especially things like the safe browsing functionality as well places chromium knowingly and forcefully into a position that doesn't make it viable to be distributed to users.
Didn't google already make it clear it's only about sync api and the rest including safe browsing is perfectly fine to use with current keys if you don't remove them[1]? I think some people here overdramatize this situation. Users who depend on sync would have to switch to chrome but for majority nothing will change unless you indeed drop the package which hardly helps to limit damage. [1] https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/chromium-packagers/c/SG6jnsP4pWM/... Yours sincerely G. K.
On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 10:31:37PM +0100, Geo Kozey via arch-general wrote:
From: Levente Polyak via arch-dev-public <arch-dev-public@lists.archlinux.org> On 1/26/21 9:53 PM, Morten Linderud via arch-dev-public wrote:
It's dissapointing frankly.
Disappointing doesn't really catch it tho. If it would be just about the sync functionality: so be it. But crippling the API usage on a level that rips out especially things like the safe browsing functionality as well places chromium knowingly and forcefully into a position that doesn't make it viable to be distributed to users.
Didn't google already make it clear it's only about sync api and the rest including safe browsing is perfectly fine to use with current keys if you don't remove them[1]?
I think some people here overdramatize this situation. Users who depend on sync would have to switch to chrome but for majority nothing will change unless you indeed drop the package which hardly helps to limit damage.
Evangelos isn't subscribed so I'm paraphrasing from what he wrote on IRC. The non-oauth api key will continue to work for now. This includes safe browsing. However: 1) We don't know for how long 2) Supposedly it's for non-commercial use 3) Jochen says it's ok to keep it, but he also said that 2013's chrome team didn't have the authority to alter the ToS. 4) Support will likely be non-existent (similarly to how we had no geolocation for the first half of 2020) -- Morten Linderud PGP: 9C02FF419FECBE16
Em janeiro 26, 2021 18:46 Morten Linderud via arch-general escreveu:
The non-oauth api key will continue to work for now. This includes safe browsing.
And geolocation. But, it looks like logging in into chromium, plus a bunch of other stuff will stop working when we remove the oauth keys.
1) We don't know for how long
Yes, they mentioned that it might change in the future.
3) Jochen says it's ok to keep it, but he also said that 2013's chrome team didn't have the authority to alter the ToS.
We are on a legal limbo if we keep it.
4) Support will likely be non-existent (similarly to how we had no geolocation for the first half of 2020)
At best. Regards, Giancarlo Razzolini
---------------------------------------- From: Morten Linderud via arch-general <arch-general@lists.archlinux.org> Sent: Tue Jan 26 22:46:52 CET 2021 To: <arch-general@lists.archlinux.org> Cc: Morten Linderud <foxboron@archlinux.org> Subject: Re: [arch-general] [arch-dev-public] Chromium losing Sync support on March 15
On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 10:31:37PM +0100, Geo Kozey via arch-general wrote:
From: Levente Polyak via arch-dev-public <arch-dev-public@lists.archlinux.org> On 1/26/21 9:53 PM, Morten Linderud via arch-dev-public wrote:
It's dissapointing frankly.
Disappointing doesn't really catch it tho. If it would be just about the sync functionality: so be it. But crippling the API usage on a level that rips out especially things like the safe browsing functionality as well places chromium knowingly and forcefully into a position that doesn't make it viable to be distributed to users.
Didn't google already make it clear it's only about sync api and the rest including safe browsing is perfectly fine to use with current keys if you don't remove them[1]?
I think some people here overdramatize this situation. Users who depend on sync would have to switch to chrome but for majority nothing will change unless you indeed drop the package which hardly helps to limit damage.
Evangelos isn't subscribed so I'm paraphrasing from what he wrote on IRC.
The non-oauth api key will continue to work for now. This includes safe browsing.
However:
1) We don't know for how long
2) Supposedly it's for non-commercial use
3) Jochen says it's ok to keep it, but he also said that 2013's chrome team didn't have the authority to alter the ToS.
4) Support will likely be non-existent (similarly to how we had no geolocation for the first half of 2020)
-- Morten Linderud PGP: 9C02FF419FECBE16
This is mostly pessimistic speculation. There are still 6 weeks ahead before anything changes at all. After that it's still possible that only the sync will be lost. IMO dropping package should be the last option used only when no other one is left on table and all bad scenarios were realized for sure (assuming there is still someone in Arch team wanting to maintain it - if not then everything may be over right now). I think fedora rush to break all users overnight while the 'evil google' gave them couple of weeks to look around isn't best example to follow. Yours sincerely G. K.
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 12:05:21AM +0100, Geo Kozey wrote:
This is mostly pessimistic speculation. There are still 6 weeks ahead before anything changes at all. After that it's still possible that only the sync will be lost. IMO dropping package should be the last option used only when no other one is left on table and all bad scenarios were realized for sure (assuming there is still someone in Arch team wanting to maintain it - if not then everything may be over right now).
I think fedora rush to break all users overnight while the 'evil google' gave them couple of weeks to look around isn't best example to follow.
Regardless of what is pessimistic speculation and not, read over the mailing list and figure out if you would like to put up with an upstream attitude like that. There is no obligation from us to the users that chromium belongs in the repository. If google acts like asses they are going to burn bridges. -- Morten Linderud PGP: 9C02FF419FECBE16
---------------------------------------- From: Morten Linderud <foxboron@archlinux.org> Sent: Wed Jan 27 00:24:13 CET 2021 To: Geo Kozey <geokozey@mailfence.com> Cc: General Discussion about Arch Linux <arch-general@lists.archlinux.org> Subject: Re: [arch-general] [arch-dev-public] Chromium losing Sync support on March 15
Regardless of what is pessimistic speculation and not, read over the mailing list and figure out if you would like to put up with an upstream attitude like that. There is no obligation from us to the users that chromium belongs in the repository.
If google acts like asses they are going to burn bridges.
-- Morten Linderud PGP: 9C02FF419FECBE16
It's not upstream attitude that I'm really afraid of. Some comments on g groups were quite offensive towards google devs which hardly encourages productive discussion. Here discussion moved from let's drop chromium from repos to let's ban all google things from AUR. I feel like bridges are already burning. You say that Arch users have no obligation from you however some folks seem very entitled for obligations from google. Shouldn't some people forget about the thing for week or two and return with a refreshed mind? Side note: if those api services were such important for users then all those forks which strip them weren't such popular (and soon they will be pointless). As firefox also uses google safe browsing api (which losing as I read is one of the reasons for dropping chromium) then I hope it won't result in firefox package dropped too within bringing the justice goal and leave Arch users only with good old lynx. Yours sincerely G. K.
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 02:18:36AM +0100, Geo Kozey wrote:
It's not upstream attitude that I'm really afraid of. Some comments on g groups were quite offensive towards google devs which hardly encourages productive discussion. Here discussion moved from let's drop chromium from repos to let's ban all google things from AUR. I feel like bridges are already burning. You say that Arch users have no obligation from you however some folks seem very entitled for obligations from google. Shouldn't some people forget about the thing for week or two and return with a refreshed mind?
Nobody is banning chrome packages from the AUR. Lets just get that straight. Google is a paid company and promoted work done by volunteers. The APIs are removed without any good reasons. "We don't feel like it anymore" is just dissapointing when they have been gladly sharing the volunteer work done by distros for years. It's not exactly painless to maintain the package either.
Side note: if those api services were such important for users then all those forks which strip them weren't such popular (and soon they will be pointless). As firefox also uses google safe browsing api (which losing as I read is one of the reasons for dropping chromium) then I hope it won't result in firefox package dropped too within bringing the justice goal and leave Arch users only with good old lynx.
qutebrowser :) -- Morten Linderud PGP: 9C02FF419FECBE16
participants (3)
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Geo Kozey
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Giancarlo Razzolini
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Morten Linderud