I agree with Ronald, but i think that we've said enough, i hope this experience will teach us a lesson, and we worked as a team in that situation and i feel good with this. Besides, i don't agree with blame Allan, could happened of any of us, the important fact is that we (his team) helped him with this situation, and i think that we discuss this in private if you have in mind to still talking about this, we have an irc channel #archlinux-tu and we can finish this subject there, i bet that many people will be talking about this just by reading this thread, and i honestly don't like the idea about that people talking about a thing that doesn't know how it was. So, i invite you all to discuss this on our irc channel or simply drop it, the fact is that Jeff Horelick won't pass the discussion period, and we won't have a votation period for him, so it's all basicly :-). Peace Angel -- angvp @ irc.freenode.net Linux Counter: #359909 Arch Linux Trusted User