Hey all I will briefly describe the situation: yesterday, Gnome 2.24 hit the repos. I issued "pacman -Suy" and, lo and behold, next time I logged in I was running Gnome 2.24. So far so good. But then I noticed that certain parts of Gnome were not there at all! It turns out, it doesn't matter if I have originally installed the package group named gnome and gnome-extras, their contents have changed (new packages added) but I did not get the new packages. Instead I had to issue a pacman -Suy --needed gnome gnome-extras in order to get the full package list. Now, I was wondering if this is on purpose or not and in my humble opinion, this is very counter-intuitive. When I first issued the "full upgrade" command, I didn't merely expect the system to bring all my packages to the latest version, I expected to have a "current" system, exactly as it would be if I had done a clean install. In fact, that's the main reason for choosing Arch: the fact that it is rolling release! This means, I expected the package manager to be smart enough to say "Aha, he wanted gnome and gnome-extras back then and I see no reason for him to *not* want the new gnome and gnome-extras now, let's install them!" Granted, this could be circumvented by issuing: $pacman --needed -Suy gnome gnome-extras but why should I be on the lookout for when a new gnome is out, for instance? Isn't that the job of the package manager? Here's an idea: why not keep track of package groups the user has *explicitly* installed and then by doing a "full-full upgrade" (let's say pacman -Syuu, double u), bring the new packages in? I could also argue that this behaviour should be the default one. Thoughts?