November 2009 - Arch-general - lists.archlinux.org

[arch-general] [signoff] mdadm-3.0.3-1
by Tobias Powalowski 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

Hi downgrade in testing repository due to potential dataloss problems: http://marc.info/?l=linux-raid&m=125748985908870&w=2 Changelog: http://neil.brown.name/git?p=mdadm;a=blob_plain;f=ANNOUNCE-3.0;hb=7f0066ba7… Please update and recreate your initcpio after upgrading. One thing i observed, when using a custom /etc/mdadm.conf file our rc.sysinit will run mdadm --assemble --scan, which will always give exit code 2, due to devices busy. greetings tpowa -- Tobias Powalowski Archlinux Developer & Package Maintainer (tpowa) http://www.archlinux.org tpowa(a)archlinux.org

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[arch-general] We have lost the desktop war. The reason? Windows 7.
by RedShift 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

This thread will probably erupt in a massive flamewar, yet I decided to post my story anyway. I am talking about the desktop experience in general, not the technical details behind it. Keep that in mind. I've been working these past few months with KDE 4.3 and it feels very sluggish and incomplete. I can't enable the desktop effects because that makes things even slower. I'm doing this on a fairly decent setup, an AMD Sempron 2 Ghz with an nVidia FX5500. My laptop suffers from this sluggishness as well. On top of that, lots of things annoy me in KDE 4.3, see the end of this post for my top annoyances. Yesterday I had to reboot to my Windows XP installation on this computer and I was shocked when I arrived in XP's userland. Everything was ridiculously fast. When returning to my linux desktop everything felt even more sluggish. That's when I decided to go back to KDE 3.5. I restored my old KDE 3.5 profile, installed the necessary packages and logged back in. WOOOOOF, everything is fast again. Opening new windows is instantaneous, hell even bringing up context menus is faster. If Linux is that much better, why does the current Linux desktop (KDE 4.3) still suck compared to an operating system that's 8 years old? Last week I also had the chance to check out Windows 7, and I was stumped. I was genuinly impressed by Windows 7's GUI. It feels fast, works fluently, it has nice effects which just work and work FAST. When browsing around it felt like a very solid desktop environment. I am jealous. I really am. The thought of using Windows 7 in favor of KDE 4.3 has occured to me much more than I like. And it's little things like dragging the windows to the top of the screen makes them maximized, dragging them to the left makes the take exactly 50% of the screen. How many times have you been manually resizing windows to fit next to each other? I have, too many times. These are things that really improve your productivity. So when should we have started working at a better desktop environment for Linux? When Mac OS X came out. When was that again? 2001. Yes, it really was that long ago. It already had awesome desktop effects that just work on (compared to these days) VERY modest hardware. And it worked fast as well. It was and still is a solid desktop environment. From that point on the Linux community should have recognized the threat Mac OS X was for the desktop environment. Unfortunately nobody did and we went on creating a big mess, fighting over implementations and technical details instead of attempting to create a solid desktop environment. Yet we did have a second chance in 2007. Microsoft obviously screwed up with Windows Vista, we had the chance to win back alot of terrain here until the release of Windows 7. So what did we come up with? KDE 4. Yes, a big dissapointment. We still don't have something that's comparable. So basically, where are we at? KDE 3.5 is Windows XP KDE 4.3 is Windows Vista ??? is Windows 7 When are we getting to the Windows 7 stage? Microsoft didn't do a big advertising campaign for the launch of Windows 7, nevertheless they delivered a big slap in the face to the Linux desktop environments. The numbers speak for themselves, Windows 7 has already sold more copies in its first week than Windows Vista did in its first month. And with good riddance, Windows 7 really is better than Windows Vista. Microsoft recognized the problems with Windows Vista and dealt with them. And dealt with them swiftly if you ask me, doing it in less then 3 years. Conclusion We are losing ground. We are losing it fast. Our competitors recognize what the user wants and delivered. If we are comparing enterprise desktops, there's no going around Red Hat. The current Red Hat desktop (5.4) ships with KDE 3.5, while its succesor RHEL 6 will be, if looking what Fedora brings now, shipped with KDE 4.2 or 4.3. That means KDE 4.2/4.3 will be the main desktop for enterprises for at least the next 3 years. A disgrace if you ask me. Users will be comparing desktop environments and they will find Windows 7 or Mac OS X to be better. After the damage RHEL 6 will have done to the reputation of the Linux desktop, it will take again as many years to rectify the damage done. Granted if we will have a solid desktop environment comparable to Windows 7 by the time RHEL 7 gets released. Which I can't help but doubt. My top KDE 4.3 annoyances: * Slooooowwww. Logging in takes a multifold of times it did under KDE 3.5, repainting windows takes up a lot of time * The battery status applet is buggy, it only shows the actual percentage after you've hovered it with the mouse, even when you've set it to always display. The scale it uses is also difficult to interpret. These bugs have been reported a long time ago and are still not fixed. * The run dialog is useless. The reason is the history function. It can't display a full history when you start typing, you have to type alot more. Having a pull down menu and using the arrow keys to select the entry you want is alot faster. Even Microsoft knows they shouldn't touch that dialog, it still works like a charm in windows 7. * Double clicking the system icon in the titlebar doesn't always work to close an application (the system icon is the left-most icon in the titlebar). This bug has also been reported a long time ago and still not fixed. * I get a full 10 minutes of extra runtime on my laptop when I switched back to 3.5 * Power management is buggy in KDE 4.3 and sometimes powerdevil just loses its settings * Some settings KDE 3.5 used to have aren't there anymore in KDE 4.3. * Where's my "home" icon!!!??? :-(

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[arch-general] looking for MUA alternative to KMail
by Philipp Gesang 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

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[arch-general] gcc -m64
by Ciprian Dorin, Craciun 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

Hello all! I have ArchLinux i686 version, but I'm trying to compile an x86_64 kernel... And you've guessed... Not supported by the ArchLinux stock gcc / binutils... I've done the "raining" dance, by trying to compile my own gcc / binutils, but it didn't "rain" (I mean it didn't work)... Any pointers? Thanks, Ciprian. P.S.: Is there any good reason for which there isn't even a separate package of gcc that is able to do this? (I've read the bug from one year ago, but no good reason was specified...) P.P.S.: I'm missing Debian...

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[arch-general] Installing Arch on Hannsnote
by Dario 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

Ciao! I want to share my (not so positive) experience about installing Arch Linux on a Hannsnote netbook, which I have been unexpectedly given as a gift recently:) I used the USB image, "burned" on a usb stick (usb-urned:)). The install went fine except when it tried to install GRUB. The installer hanged (don't know if it really hanged or if it just wanted to use all the CPU for some time), but I went about it by manually installing GRUB, so this is not really a problem. The Intel 945GME is recognized, but all I get from X is a blank screen, if using the intel driver or leaving the duty to a config-less X, or doing some other tricks from the wiki and the forum. No errors whatsoeverm though, just a black dead screen. The vesa driver worked fine, but stuck at 800x600. Finally, I couldn't work out a way to use the wireless card, a Ralink 2860 or something. I mean, not even the interface was shown, even if modules were - at least to me - correctly loaded. Having tried Puppy Linux before with success, I knew that things should have worked. Now, I installed Kubuntu Netbook edition and everything works out of the box. Unfortunately it won't last long on my laptop, its interface is scarying:) I'd really like to archify my netbook. It came with XP preinstalled, but I cannot use it without a Linux operating system, for practical and also psychological reasons (no, not ideological:) ). If someone had a similar experience to share, I'd be happy:) Thanks in advance!!! Dario Chiacchiera con i tuoi amici in tempo reale! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/*http://it.messenger.yahoo.com

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[arch-general] Problem with hard disk - not arch related
by Dario 07 Nov '09

07 Nov '09

Ciao! This is unrelated to arch, but I wanted to tell this to the list because maybe someone has a clue. I have recently bought and installed a new sata hard disk. It has a couple of partitions, one with XFS which I use as storage. It generally works fine, but sometimes something happens and it cease to work. I don't know if it's the disc's fault, because at the next restart the problems are gone. It seems that the controller sometimes gets lost. Dmesg says this: ata4.00: exception Emask 0x0 SAct 0x0 SErr 0x0 action 0x6 ata4.00: BMDMA stat 0x25 ata4.00: cmd 35/00:20:e7:a0:f1/00:01:04:00:00/e0 tag 0 dma 147456 out res 51/84:11:e7:a0:f1/84:00:00:00:00/e0 Emask 0x10 (ATA bus error) ata4.00: status: { DRDY ERR } ata4.00: error: { ICRC ABRT } ata4: soft resetting link ata4.00: configured for UDMA/133 ata4: EH complete ... (repeat some time) .... ata4.00: qc timeout (cmd 0x27) ata4.00: failed to read native max address (err_mask=0x4) ata4.00: HPA support seems broken, skipping HPA handling ata4.00: revalidation failed (errno=-5) ata4: link is slow to respond, please be patient (ready=0) ata4: soft resetting link ata4: SRST failed (errno=-16) ata4: reset failed, giving up ata4: EH complete ... sd 3:0:0:0: [sdc] Unhandled error code sd 3:0:0:0: [sdc] Result: hostbyte=0x04 driverbyte=0x00 end_request: I/O error, dev sdc, sector 82953831 ... I/O error in filesystem ("sdc2") meta-data dev sdc2 block 0x104d6d83 ("xlog_iodone") error 5 buf count 6656 xfs_force_shutdown(sdc2,0x2) called from line 1043 of file fs/xfs/xfs_log.c. Return address = 0xf9c8d923 Filesystem "sdc2": Log I/O Error Detected. Shutting down filesystem: sdc2 Please umount the filesystem, and rectify the problem(s) ... Buffer I/O error on device sdc2, logical block 603726 lost page write due to I/O error on sdc2 So, what should I look for? Together with the disk, I installed an Nvidia 9800 GT, which could also be the culprit, because maybe I haven't a proper power unit etc. - or not? Thanks in advance to everybody! Ciao a tutti Dario Chiacchiera con i tuoi amici in tempo reale! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/*http://it.messenger.yahoo.com

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[arch-general] Mayday - Installed Fresh Archlinux on Laptop - Resolution stuck 1152x864, need 1440x900??
by David C. Rankin 06 Nov '09

06 Nov '09

Listmates, New drive for my laptop so I dedicated it to Arch. Net install with 2009.08 went fine (although there really should be a warning when you leave install WITHOUT configuring the bootloader). [the /arch/setup menu autoadvances when you leave Configure System and if you click Done and downarrow anticipating moving to the next item, you can easily miss configuring the bootloader (I did ;-)] The problem I have is that my laptop is stuck in 1152x864 resolution. For the text install that is fantastic, but when you start kde -- not so good. (should be 1440x900) The card is an RS690M (radeon 1200) and the radeon driver was loaded by default. The modules configured are: 22:46 alchemy:~> lsmod | grep rad radeon 716352 1 ttm 43776 1 radeon drm 191392 2 radeon,ttm i2c_algo_bit 6980 1 radeon i2c_core 25664 4 radeon,i2c_piix4,drm,i2c_algo_bit THE WEIRD PART... I have Arch on the drive I just took out and it goes to 1440x900 just fine. I am not using an xorg.conf, so I am pretty much at X's mercy. I use /etc/rc.d/kdm start from runlevel 3 to start kdm. It goes to 1152x864 instead of 1440x900. I don't understand how to control the new KMS stuff. I have check the kde4 settings for Display Size and Orientations, but the maximum allowed is 1152x864: http://www.3111skyline.com/download/bugs/kde4/kde4-syssettings-display.jpg http://www.3111skyline.com/download/bugs/kde4/kde4-syssettings-1164.png What is the trick? Also, when I try to start xdm from inittab with the default x:5:respawn:/usr/bin/xdm -nodaemon I get the disabling for 5 seconds, respawning too fast error. So, what's the trick here? I bet there related... I have put the Xorg.0.log on the server as well: http://www.3111skyline.com/download/bugs/kde4/Xorg.0.log It looks like the dang thing is using the vesa driver?? I'll add radeon to modules, but It's loaded already so I don't think that's going to help. Anybody know what's happening here? This is the first install where I haven't installed KDE3, so i don't know if that is a part of the issue either. Any help would be greatly appreciated. If you need to see anything else, just let me know. Thanks. -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961 Telephone: (936) 715-9333 Facsimile: (936) 715-9339 www.rankinlawfirm.com

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[arch-general] kde4 only install - how do I get quanta?? how do I cnf the kde3 runtime environment?
by David C. Rankin 06 Nov '09

06 Nov '09

Guys, This is the first time I have done a install that doesn't include kde3 and I'm running into a few problems: (1) I can't find quanta -- where is it hiding? (2) how does one configure the default font size, etc.. for the kde3-runtime-base without the kde3 control center? kcmshell for the kde3 runtime base list no modules?? -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961 Telephone: (936) 715-9333 Facsimile: (936) 715-9339 www.rankinlawfirm.com

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Re: [arch-general] [arch-dev-public] [PATCH] makechrootpkg: Use the host's SRCDEST and PKGDEST if they are defined
by Rogutės Sparnuotos 06 Nov '09

06 Nov '09

Daenyth Blank (2009-11-05 13:07): > On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 13:03, Aaron Griffin <aaronmgriffin(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > I was thinking more along the lines of: > > > > Original: eval $(grep '^SRCDEST=' /etc/makepkg.conf) > > > > SRCDEST=$(grep '^SRCDEST=' /etc/makepkg.conf | cut -d= -f2) > > PKGDEST=$(grep '^PKGDEST=' /etc/makepkg.conf | cut -d= -f2) > > > > I believe that should work... Make sure to throw in a -d -w check > after, to make sure it's right... I think a malicious line (".. && rm > -rf /") would simply get stored as a string.. as long as we quote > everything properly and unset it if it's not right, I'm pretty sure > it's not dangerous. It could however, fail in cases where it's split > over multiple lines. I don't think that's a reason not to do it > though, I can't imagine a reason for such a thing. This wouldn't work for SRCDEST="/path/to/dir" SRCDEST='/path/to/dir' But sed should be able to do it: SRCDEST=$(sed -nr "/^SRCDEST=/{s/[^=]+=(['\"]?)(.+)\1/\2/p}" /etc/makepkg.conf) -- -- Rogutės Sparnuotos

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[arch-general] S3-level ACPI suspend
by b4283 05 Nov '09

05 Nov '09

Hi, I've had some nice experiences with Windows(XP)'s suspend functionality, and it seems to work on all machines I've worked with. and the other day I just had a successful resume on my machine with "s2ram -f -m -p", but it takes like a minute for it to fully recover to a terminal (tty/1). (ps: my computer is a desktop with AMD RS780 chipset, which isn't supported by KMS yet) Unlike Windows ones, which only take like 3-5 seconds to wake up, linux takes much longer, I don't know if this is common... My question is: What's the average resume time of yours, and is it possible to be any faster ?

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